Keith and His Koran
Posted by Andy on December 26th, 2006
Hey Keith Did You Beat Your Wife? Your Koran Says You Must
Keith Ellison (Dem. MN-CD5) was riling up his fellow Muslims over the weekend (of course in other states as he is the Muslim Congressman not Minnesota’s 5th District Rep, you didn’t really think he wouldn’t be running around in Minnesota anymore) over his determination to swear his oath of office on the Koran. IN Detroit, he urged his fellow Muslims to stay true to their religion and educate the Americans how to be ‘just’ just like them.
“You can’t back down. You can’t chicken out. You can’t be afraid. You got to have faith in Allah, and you’ve got to stand up and be a real Muslim,” Detroit native Keith Ellison said to loud applause.
Many in the crowd replied “Allahu akbar” — God is great.
Hey, isn’t that what the terrorists say before they blow up innocent civilians? And why did he have to move to Minnesota? Couldn’t he have just stayed in Detroit? What, you didn’t know Ellison isn’t a life long Minnesotan?
But Ellison, speaking at the annual convention of the Muslim American Society and the Islamic Circle of North America, said that Muslims can help teach America about justice and equal protection.
And that is what gets me to the point where people need to properly educate Minnesotans and Americans about Ellison and his Koran. There are many different resources on the web about the Koran, some good some unreliable. I found this one that seems good. It goes through 10 disturbing things that are law if you you follow the Koran.
You see, part of what the Koran does is lay out Sharia law, or how people MUST live. Here’s a few quick takes from the analysis. Go read the whole article. Follow the links and do your research. Here’s the 10 points that you’ll find documented and examples of current practice are even provided.
10. Islam commands that drinkers and gamblers should be whipped.
9. Islam allows husbands to hit their wives even if the husbands merely fear highhandedness in their wives.
8. Islam allows an injured plaintiff to exact legal revenge—physical eye for physical eye.
7. Islam commands that a male and female thief must have a hand cut off.
6. Islam commands that highway robbers should be crucified or mutilated.
5. Islam commands that homosexuals must be executed.
4. Islam orders unmarried fornicators to be whipped and adulterers to be stoned to death.
3. Islam orders death for Muslim and possible death for non—Muslim critics of Muhammad and the Quran and even sharia itself.
2. Islam orders apostates to be killed.
1. Islam commands offensive and aggressive and unjust jihad.
Ellison and the CAIR folks are running around saying they are a ‘peaceful’ religion. Well, fine, define ‘peaceful’. Is beating your wife peaceful? How about cutting off people’s hands? Killing non muslims simply because they refuse to convert? Or banishing people from a region entirely on their religious choice?
The Quran says:
4:34 . . . If you fear highhandedness from your wives, remind them [of the teaching of God], then ignore them when you go to bed, then hit them. If they obey you, you have no right to act against them. God is most high and great. (MAS Abdel Haleem, the Qur’an, Oxford UP, 2004)
Well, does Ellison beat his wife, or did he beat his ex-wife? Does he see it as acceptable for a Muslim man to beat a woman?
You can chalk me up as one who will not convert. Only a mad man would allow a book like this drive their decision making process. Sharia law laid out in the Koran is barbaric. Some would say the Koran advocates torture, heck it recommends it for some violations of Sharia law.
So when Keith Ellison places his hand on that Koran next month, keep in mind, it has a whole other set of laws in it. Those laws smack our Constitution in the face. I would just tell you to compare the 10 points from the article to our Bill of Rights. If Ellison doesn’t believe ALL aspects of his religion and the book he wants to use in his swearing in, then he should publicly distance himself from those barbaric acts and take the lead in reforming his religion.
He should educate his fellow Muslims that beating women is a bad thing. That chopping off hands is not humane punishment, and that caning is not as well. The burden should be on Ellison to prove he is not what we think he is, a radical muslim. Remember, not all of them are blowing people up, but some of them are trying to make it so the ones who will, can walk freely among us with out any question.
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December 27th, 2006 at 2:10 pm
Hilarious!
So if Keith Ellison takes the oath on the Quran, he is implicitly endorsing everything found in its pages, right?
Under this logic, Andy, anyone who swears on a Bible is endorsing everything found within its pages. EVERYTHING.
That means that if your brother dies and his wife has no children, you must marry her. It’s clearly stated in Leviticus 28.
Know any gays or lesbians, Andy? For their sakes, I hope not. Because Leviticus 20 clearly states that you must kill them.
Was your wife a virgin when you married? If not, you would have to kill her too.
How about a woman who commits adultery? Once again, you have to kill her.
What about Buddhists or Taoists or pagans, or anyone else who doesn’t believe in the God of the Bible? It’s quite clear in Leviticus 20:22: “Show him no pity or compassion…but take his life. Let your hand be the first against him to put him to death”.
December 27th, 2006 at 2:43 pm
First off, before I play your game, I do not know of any countries, regions, or violent groups of people actually doing those things ANYMORE. There are currently people using the Koran and the words in it to cause a World war.
Bro dies: Hasn’t happened, besides, they are both hot. (Also note, Divorce was not condoned either as I understand it)
Lezs: I know of one person that I actually know, and as much satisfaction as me and others would take at never having to deal with her again, I will not be killing Eva Young. Quite honestly, I could care less if someone was homosexual. I’m guessing you didn’t follow the links to the examples of instances in the last 2-3 years where Sharia law was carried out by Governments in the region.
Wife: Single, mute point.
Adultery: I believe it is the husband who has to, so again, I’m single, mute point.
Non-believers: If we can add atheist and agnostics for sure, then I’m all for it.
Its called tradition, just like I couldn’t go to Saudi Arabia or Iran etc and take an oath of office on the Catholic Bible, why should we be required to be accompanying here?
I would NEVER force anyone to take their oath on the Bible of ANY religion. There are precedents for people NOT using the Bible, Ellison refused to follow that option. He’s a glory hound, hell bent on making his religion the issue.
Note: There have been a lot of Jewish people who have sworn an oath on the Bible.
How about we drop all religious displays during swearing in, and they ALL have to swear on the US Constitution? The written one, not the Judicial version.
December 27th, 2006 at 3:55 pm
So, you’re saying that people can swear on the Bible because draconian Mosaic laws are not enforced in the United States?
Well guess what, smart guy: neither are draconian Islamic laws.
It doesn’t matter whether or not people are “practicing” Mosaic law anymore, Andy. Don’t try to change the subject.
Your thesis is that if Keith Ellison puts his hand on the Quran during the ceremonial swearing-in, he is endorsing the totality of Islamic law. Every legal statute stated in that book — that’s what he’s endorsing.
By extension, in your view, swearing on a Bible must mean that the office-holder is endorsing each and every Mosaic statute that can be found there.
Truth is, Ellison’s an American citizen and he has a right to hold any book he chooses during the ceremony. That’s his right, Andy — not a privilege bestowed by the government.
You’ve already fallen back on “tradition” as a reason to compel Ellison to use a Bible, but that doesn’t make any more sense than the rest of your argument.
The Constitution doesn’t have a “tradition” clause. It’s a really interesting document, though. You ought to find a copy and read it sometime.
December 28th, 2006 at 8:22 am
Here’s your and Ellison’s problem.
Ellison has CLOSE ties with groups that support or fund people who are using the Koran to incite the Jihad (read global war against Western civilization). Ellison is also demanding to use the same book that they are using to draw their inspiration from. They are trying to take down our civilization. When was the last time that the Bible was used for something like that? I think it was about 1000 years ago.
This entire thing is a stunt. He has taken the oath for the MN Legislature 2 times with out the Koran. Why is he just now trying to make his religion a big deal?
If he is trying to educate us dumb Americans about his religion, why won’t he come out and say that the people who ARE using the Koran to enforce the barbaric laws still today are dead wrong? I haven’t heard him do it yet.
If you are trying to educate me, why are you just insulting me and trying to say my religion sucks so much?
December 28th, 2006 at 11:23 am
Like Glenn Beck, you are demanding that Ellison prove a negative. Essentially, you’re asking him to prove that he doesn’t support foreign theocratic Islamic regimes and doesn’t support terrorists. And this is only being demanded because he is a Muslim.
That’s kind of like demanding that any man who runs for elected office prove that he isn’t in favor of murder, because most murders are committed by men.
If you have evidence that Ellison has “close ties” with terrorist organizations, then I suggest you stop jabbering about it on your blog and immediately call the Department of Homeland Security. I suspect you won’t, because you have no evidence. Just suspicions borne out of prejudice and paranoia.
As for Ellison trying to “educate us dumb Americans about his religion”, that’s more evidence that you just don’t get it. Ellison isn’t a foreigner, and he isn’t a second-class citizen. He’s an American. He has all the rights of citizenship that you have.
By the way, Andy — I’m not insulting you, I’m disagreeing with you. There’s a difference. Moreover, I’ve never said that your religion “sucks”. I don’t even know what your religion is. What makes you think that you know what my religion is?
December 28th, 2006 at 11:36 am
Nope it is because he has ties with groups that do support “foreign theocratic Islamic regimes” and “terrorists” which MDE has been very good at documenting.
Did you read his speech in Detroit?
But Ellison, speaking at the annual convention of the Muslim American Society and the Islamic Circle of North America, said that Muslims can help teach America about justice and equal protection.
That’s the quote that sparked me off. He is saying Muslims have to teach America about “justice and equal protection” What unifying thing do Muslims have? The Koran. What is in it? The rest of the stuff in my post. Stuff that is being done today, by Muslim theocracies around the globe.
Why is it wrong to ask Ellison to admit that he disapproves with Muslim theocracies and the barbaric tortures (Sharia law found in the Koran) that they are still doing today?
What is his belief on women’s rights? Does a Muslim American man have the right to treat his wife like a Saudi Muslim man does? Or do American laws supersede? I think, just like Michele Bachmann was forced to distance herself a pastor in her religion, Ellison should not get a pass because he has the correct party affiliation or because he is a minority.
It is Ellison’s aspirations mixed with his religion that scare me. He wants to lead a movement, like Wellstone (its documented that he has long had a goal to follow in Wellstone’s footsteps and be just like him) but the movement he is racing towards is one that I see people leading in other areas towards violence against the US and Western society.
Another great question would be does Ellison agree with the widely held Muslim belief that Jews need to be killed?
A worthy question for any American involved in foreign policy or governance.
December 28th, 2006 at 1:06 pm
Well, that didn’t take long. You’ve abandoned defending your assertions and are now just repeating them over and over, like an exhausted game show host.
Once again, you assert that Keith Ellison is a threat because of his “close ties” to terrorist organizations. If you or MDE actually have evidence of this — not rumor or innuendo or slander — it is your duty to immediately alert the authorities. Your duty, Andy. I’m calling your bluff, boyo.
Once again, you assert that by taking the oath of office on the Quran, Ellison will be placing the supremacy of Islamic law over the authority of the Constitution. But you have still not explained why officeholders who take the oath of office on the Bible are not placing the authority supremacy of Mosaic law over the authority of the Constitution.
Nor have you explained how a person holding either the Bible or the Quran can be construed to be placing the edicts of faith over their responsibilities to the Constitution. Here is the oath that the members of Congress take:
“I do solemnly swear that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; that I take this obligation freely, without any mental reservation or purpose of evasion; and that I will well and faithfully discharge the duties of the office on which I am about to enter: So help me God.”
That oath, you will note, is to support and defend the Constitution of the United States, not a particular religious tradition.
December 28th, 2006 at 2:24 pm
For the last 230 or so years people have been using the Bible, and how many times has the Mosaic laws you mention been used? More importantly, recently?
But we DO have people saying that in order to be good Muslims you have to follow Sharia law. Is Ellison a good Muslim? Leaders of the Muslim faith are out there demanding their laws be followed. When Americans go to their lands they are forced to follow their laws. As they should, but many are derived from or out of the Koran.
I am wondering why it bothers you so that one would raise the question of what exactly is in that book Ellison wants to be the first to use for such a reason. Why is it such a problem that someone raise questions or concerns of a man with such a questionable history? He has defended cop killers. He has been less than forth coming about why he didn’t pay taxes. He has lived a life that seems less than impeccable, and leaves room for doubt of his intentions.
Why does it bother you so to ask him to say whether or not he believes everything in the Koran. I don’t believe everything in the Bible, I can say that about my religious book, why can’t he? That’s all he’d have to do. Come out and publicly state that he doesn’t believe in Sharia law and that it has no place in the US, let alone have someone propose laws (as a member of Congress) that would mirror Islamic laws from other Nations?
The proof of how the Koran is being used to wage a Jihad is clear, it should be those who feel it is such an important part of their life to educate us. That is what he says Muslims should do to Americans. Well, why doesn’t he practice what he preaches?
What can I learn from the Koran that isn’t written in it? Sharia law is written in their, is that the part I am supposed to learn?
Regarding the oath verbiage will he say “God”? Or will he say “Alah”? Do we know?
December 28th, 2006 at 4:03 pm
“That’s all he’d have to do. Come out and publicly state that he doesn’t believe in Sharia law and that it has no place in the US, let alone have someone propose laws (as a member of Congress) that would mirror Islamic laws from other Nations?”
No, Andy, he doesn’t have to do it. What you’re proposing is a religious test for holding office — expressly forbidden by the Constitution. He’s been elected by the voters in the 5th district. They are the ones who decide whether he’s fit to serve — not you.
Once in Congress, I suppose he could propose any nutty thing he wanted. That’s his right as well. And it would be the right of his peers in Congress to vote his proposals up or down. And it would be the right of his constituents to vote him out of office in two years if they so desired.
That’s democracy, buddy. That’s how it works.
As I have already stated, the oath he will take is to protect and defend the Constitution of the United States of America. Not to protect and defend the Quran, or anything in it. Not to protect and defend the Bible, or anything in that either. Holding a religious text in your hand during the swearing-in ceremony does not negate, impede, undermine or in any way weaken that oath of office.
Your argument is nonsensical. It just collapses under its own weight. Ellison is under no obligation to do any of the things you’re demanding.
December 28th, 2006 at 4:54 pm
Religious Test? BS! He’s the one using his new power as a member of Congress as a way for his religion to “educate” us Americans. That’s what the speech he gave in Detroit was about. He sounded a hell of a lot like a religious leader there to me, more than a member of Congress. And why is it that he hasn’t been giving speeches here in MN’s 5th? But rather galavanting round the country to one Muslim fundraiser to another? Was he elected to Rep MN’s 5th, or All American Muslims or those within America?
And if Ellison is preaching for his followers to educate ME, why shouldn’t I be able to ask him to explain his religion? See, unlike you, I presume who is Liberal, I don’t demand Government answer all my questions, I, Me, AAA, am demanding Ellison do it. I hope others feel the same, and enough pressure is put on him publicly and by the media (laugh) that he does have to explain himself, because so far he has been getting away scot free.
Oh, and go check the original post I made, I didn’t say he shouldn’t use it, what I said that when he does, WE should be aware what is in that book. Pay attention!
December 28th, 2006 at 5:06 pm
Your argument is nonsensical. It just collapses under its own weight. Ellison is under no obligation to do any of the things you’re demanding.
December 28th, 2006 at 5:58 pm
Fine, then I’ll just continue to go about my life uninformed of all the wonders that are Islam since no Muslim is willing to tell me about them.
Maybe it isn’t much different than the book afterall.
December 28th, 2006 at 6:27 pm
So you’re saying you’ve read the Quran?
The whole thing?
Because your post suggested you’d only read an article ABOUT the Quran.
January 5th, 2007 at 8:39 am
About wife beating in Islam:
http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaE&cid=1119503544256
You can read if you want to know. Thanks.
January 5th, 2007 at 7:20 pm
For most of us living in Minnesota who are actually familiar with Ellison’s record, all of this outrage seems a little over-the-top.
Before anyone gets bent out of shape, I hope they take the time to look into Rep. Ellison’s record and some of the other details of his life.
You can’t pin him with “Muslims want to convert or kill everyone.” The biggest piece of evidence for this is that his wife is not even a Muslim. Nor are his siblings or his parents. It is pure alarmism to say that someone who won’t force is religion on his wife is going to force it on the rest of us.
The fact that some Muslims are oppressive of women, homosexuals and Jews is undisputed, but you cannot possibly implicate Rep. Ellison in this. In fact, he has made his name here in Minnesota politics by standing up for gay rights and women’s reproductive rights at every opportunity in the state house of representatives. Also, he received the endorsement of the biggest Jewish newspaper in MN, even though his republican opponent was a Jew.
Rep. Ellison has never held office in the middle east and so he can not be held responsible for abuses of those governments. Where he HAS held office is here in MN, and I can assure you it is quite a nice place to live. Come for a visit sometime and witness that despite the 3 terms he has served in our legislature, we are still quite free of sharia law. In fact, Minneapolis (his district) is consistently listed as one of the top 3 most livable cities in the US, MN is the best state for overall health, and Minneapolis is one of the most gay-friendly cities in the US. Ellison hasn’t run our state into the ground yet, and we have no reason to think he will do so with the whole nation.
You can disagree with his politics and that is fine, but to try to portray him as a screaming reactionary jihadist who wants to hurl us back into the 7th century is just dishonest.
January 5th, 2007 at 7:22 pm
Oh, and on the topic of wife-beating: during the campaign it came out that his Republican opponent (a Jew) actually did beat his ex-wife. Ellison has not been accused of any such thing.
January 5th, 2007 at 8:09 pm
Then will Ellison please tell me and other just what the heck he wants us to learn about it? Because the only people making noise on behalf of Islam are doing it with IEDs and blood.
Oh and define liveable. thirty-some % increase in violent crime? High taxes? Poor education….